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April 22, 2011

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Jimmy Hill

If a person is poor if they can't afford a decent house in London doesn't this mean that almost any distribution of weatlh that isn't completely egalitarian will mean that some people are poor?

Given that there are only so many decent houses in London even slight inequality will mean that some people will be able to afford to live there and others not.

Finally, your last point is only a paradox if you insist on seeing the world through the lens of class based ideology. :)

Keith

Alternatively you could just see this as an example of how people are never satisfied with what they have and want more. This is the classic argument against economic orthodoxy, i.e. both the Left and Right think that growth and more stuff makes you better of in some sort of philosophical sense. "Happier" or "content" when it only makes you aspire to ever more material rewards and social distinctions and makes you jealous of people poorer than you who may be less invested in competition for material success and so apparently better off. And once a minimum standard of life is achieved maybe they are better off. But then can you muster up the balls to jump off the escalator you have been riding for years maybe since private school? Resentment may be at your own lack of courage to make a fundamental change in life.

BT

Massively increased inequality makes even Mr 100K per year jealous of the top 1%.

95% of people today say they are middle class - they survive on their wages and have a modest net worth.

Even those who own assets, such as their home, normally also have large debts, such as their mortgage. So their net worth is not high.

To be considered rich today, you must have far more in assets than in debt and be able to live on the income from your assets without working, if necessary.

gastro george

The article pointed to by Norm is patently rubbish. It just reflects that, if people think some people should be paying more tax, it shouldn't be them.

Other surveys that directly ask US citizens where they fit in the income spectrum show that people place themselves much higher than their real position - they don't realise how unequal the US is.

Cahal

I have thought this for a while, and in my opinion it basically comes down to the financial sector (yet again). Even someone on a 6 figure salary will have a mortgage and probably some other debts, so at the end of the day they are answerable to the financial institutions like everyone else.

CharlieMcMenamin

I can't quite see your point regarding the Tube. I'd have thought it more accurate to say that it is *only* in cities with functioning mass transport (which means London in a British context - and Newcastle at a push) that those earning £100k are likely to meet those on,say, £15k on their way to work. Elsewhere, they just drive in their expensive cars.

charlieman

@CharlieMcMenamin: "I'd have thought it more accurate to say that it is *only* in cities with functioning mass transport (which means London in a British context - and Newcastle at a push) that those earning £100k are likely to meet those on,say, £15k on their way to work."

Indeed, most London tourist guide books remark about happy banter conducted on the underground. The wealthy converse with shop girls and building workers, only the most snooty hiding behind their newspapers with disregard to the discourse around them. The movie "Pretty Woman" is based on one of such encounters, but its transportation to Los Angeles renders the story less credible.

CharlieMcMenamin

Charlieman: yeah, that's quite funny. But you do meet - using a fairly minimal definition of 'meet', as in get crushed next too - people who aren't like yourself on the tube, and you don't in an executive car

Denny

I always say if we just educate folks from the beginning we delete all these issues. Get a credit card buy real estate an asset not a TV. Pretty simple in my opinion.

socialist steve

'We have the worst of both worlds'

Oh, my heart really bleeds for you.

Glenn

Hmm working in London, leave home @ 7.30, back home @ 8pm; its dirty, smelly, you're working for some dictatorial public school boy who knows fuck all, and have barely time to eat lunch. 40 years of this to get a final salary pension which they've diluted down to nowt by the time you claim it (early because you've been restructured out of a job and forced into retirement). Such is life in the civil service!

That's why some of us feel poor. Shit jobs, we can't do anything else and are locked into a dirty, shitty way of life. Oh and we own a tiny home that may be 10 miles from the centre of London, but might as well be 100 miles away (the trains would be faster).

Jen Love

great info. hehe.. please check this website. this is where i get infos too.. thanks!
http://www.enablefinance.com

Mariana

People are never satisfied with their condition and they are always trying to be much better off than their peers.

Will Richardson

Anyone who cannot afford to live from the income their capital generates that is has to earn their income is by definition a worker.

How middle class people are taken in is a mystery!

Some interesting graphs of how labour productivity has lagged earnings, despite the massive increase in top salaries keeping this up higher than it would be otherwise;

http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=13193

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